Episode Transcript
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Hi, and welcome to A Time to Thrill. It's me, your host, Amy Austin. Welcome to November.
Autumn is my favorite month. So I'm thrilled it's not, you know, cold and sweater weather and changing leaves here in Southern California, but it's not hot, and that has to be enough. So this month I have the pleasure of speaking with debut author Lisa Cheek. So I met Lisa, okay. A few months ago, I started going to these book things. They're called Happy Women Dinners. This woman runs them in, well, it used to be northern Southern California. Now I think she's expanded across the country. And what they are, at least the ones I attend, are book talks, usually held at someone's house, and we talk about the authors there and we get to discuss their book. The one I went to previously was Liz Lenz, the American Ex wife. And this one I went to a few weeks ago was the Life Brief with Bonnie Wan.
If you check my Instagram, there's photos of me at these.
So what I really enjoy about this is the opportunity to talk to authors that I don't know.
So outside of my romance thriller genre fiction bubble, and to meet interesting women who are readers and care about self development, self improvement, other nonfiction topics. There's one with Evrotsky even, where we talked about, like, women's emotional labor. So these, to me are super interesting things and an opportunity to talk to people about them. These kinds of things were popular in New York City before, but in Southern California, it waxes and wanes. I mean, I had a friend who ran a reading salon for a couple of years. They come and go, but I do love to attend them and will get in my car and leave my house to do it.
Anyway, at the last one, I met Lisa Cheek, although I think we attended a different one together.
And so she's a debut author and we're going to talk about her book, Cinderella Sit in this podcast.
But it's interesting. So this is a memoir. And I, you know, memoirs go in and out of style.
You know, we used to have autobiographies and biographies. Now we just have memoirs, which are different in the sense that they're usually like a slice of life, particular story from a particular point of view by the author.
And I love them because, like, fiction can be like a window into people's lives, but the people aren't real. And memoirs are a picture like a window into people's lives, and they are real. And I find it fascinating because I always want to know more about other people's lives without having to live the experience myself, I've had enough experiences in my own and I don't need to like branch out and have every life experience. But the. That doesn't mean I don't want to know about it. So we'll talk to Lisa in a little bit. But it's super interesting to get a perspective on, you know, memoir, the writing process, the time she spent in this book in China, which is interesting. I've spent time in China myself. It's a very interesting country to visit, mainly because as Americans, we are kind of limited in what we can do there. You have to file like an itinerary, you have to get a visa. Like it's a little bit of a process.
And the government is a little ever present when one is in China. So we do talk a little bit about that and hopefully you'll find it interesting.
Let's see. As far as writing goes, I am writing. So I'm starting on. Starting in the midst of writing book 30, which will be out who knows when, but a long time from now. All that said, His Last Mistress is up for pre order. I will say that the date has moved from January to April, the publication date, mainly because there's just not enough time between now and January to do what's necessary to publicize the book. There have been some glitches.
I am waiting for some paperbacks that are like a month and a half late, which apparently is happening to a lot of people. But you can't send out advanced reader copies of paperbacks for those who only read paperbacks when you don't have them. But I'm hopeful. Fingers crossed. I'm either going to end up with a whole bunch of boxes of paperbacks or I'm going to have to try again. I don't know.
I've gotten a lot of promises that it's coming, but, you know, what does that mean? Anyway, so His Lost Mistress I am super excited about. Even with the pushback date for April.
It is. The date is correct on every platform except Amazon, which is its own bear to wrestle and haven't done that yet.
I'm super excited about this book because it really sort of delves into the psychological aspects of thriller writing, which I'm now moving a little bit more toward and a little less procedural. So there is a trial. Let me not say that there's a trial in His Lost Mistress, but so while we get the trial aspects and Casey's in court and Nicole's in court and Justin McPhee's in court, everybody's in Court.
We also delve into why does he do that? Why is he that way? And it's super interesting to sort of look at the perspective of one person who's like a little chaos monster from everybody's perspective, who has to manage him.
Great things in store as we lead up to that book.
So, all that said, without further ado, let's get to this interview with Lisa Cheek, the author of Sit Cinderella, Sit.
Hi, and welcome to A Time to Thrill. This is me, your host, Amy Austin. This month I have the delight of speaking with Lisa Cheek. Say hi, Lisa.
[00:06:36] Speaker B: Hi, how are you? I'm really happy to be here. Thank you for asking me.
[00:06:42] Speaker A: Yeah, I'm so excited to speak to you because you have, well, let me say this. So when you were describing China, so I've been to China, I spent like three weeks in China in2016. I had to think about it and it's, it's, it's an interesting place. So I'm going to ask you this.
[00:07:00] Speaker B: Did you.
[00:07:01] Speaker A: Because I had to get a visa, not a work visa because I wasn't working, but I still had to get a visa. You have to provide them, at least in la, I think I had to go to June Street. You have to provide them with like an ID itinerary. And then also who is going to be with you at every phase of your stay in China, which was, I felt like I was being chaperoned, you know what I mean? And it was interesting. So. And my visa is good for 10 years. I think I have a couple of years left. But how did you find, did you, did you know, going in that it was going to be that, how can I say this kindly intensive a process to get, to get there. Because I know many people who have been to China and nobody said to me, oh, by the way, you, you have to provide an itinerary and everywhere that you're going to be while you're there.
[00:07:46] Speaker B: No. And you know, it's funny because I like to think I'm a well traveled person. That's why I, when you and I sat next to each other and we started finding out how far, you know, we traveled a lot. And it was sort of like I thought, oh, this is old, I'm all had at this. This is not going to be a problem. And it was a comp, it was an adventure I had, you know, I knew it was going to be an adventure. I just didn't know how much of one, you know, and that's, that's what makes it an adventure.
[00:08:12] Speaker A: Right.
[00:08:12] Speaker B: You have no idea what you're in for.
But, no, I mean, luckily, I had a. You know, I had a whole production crew behind me, so.
But, you know, I had no idea what I was doing. Not absolutely none.
[00:08:27] Speaker A: No. I. I was thinking about it because. So previous to China, I had. I had been to Korea, which I think is not that foreign. I'd been to Japan, which at the time felt very foreign. It's the only place I've ever been to people at the time, I heard it's different now, did not speak English, mostly at all. And I was like, oh, this is gonna be an adventure. And also they drive on the other side of the street, which I didn't know until I almost got hit stepping out of the train station. So up until then, I was like, I'm well traveled. I know what I'm doing. And I got to China, and I was like, oh, this is. This. This is. This is different.
But other things you describe. So Lisa's book is called Sit, Cinderella, Sit, and it's a memoir of some time in China and then also interspersed with some personal memories. But what I found.
So China. So what I found interesting was that it was. I call the whole rigmarole. Like, it was a little bit more than I thought, more intense than I thought. Were you looking forward? I know you went. I don't want to say, like, not a time of crisis. I think that's overstating it. But you went for a job, and, you know, you had a job to do and money to make, what were you anticipating the adventure was going to be, like?
[00:09:41] Speaker B: Well, I honestly, I've never been on a location like that before. I've been on sets and cut on sets, and I. I've done that. But not in rural China along the Tibetan border.
That was definitely, you know, an experience. And when I, you know, spoke to the production manager, who was American Chinese, actually, that there was one or two other people who did speak English, and she. She, you know, you and your assistant have got to order everything. Like, we need backups. We need everything. Because it's not like, you know, we can get anything just flown in anywhere, you know. And this was 2008, so. And I had just learned also, technically, I had been an avid editor for 25 years, and final cut had just come out. So also, you know, and I'm not. I would, you know, I needed really technical assistance. That was not my forte. I am much better. Let me tell you a story, but don't make me turn on the computer.
It's a button I can't find. So, yeah.
[00:10:53] Speaker A: And how can I say this? Okay, one thing in your book that struck me, because this is something that struck me. So while I was touring, so I only went to Beijing, which is separate, and then south eastern China, in like March or April. In March and April. But one of the things that I thought was interesting, you were talking about like hunting or something. And at some point we were leaving Shanghai, which has like 35, 40 million people. So I get it. And he's like, oh, we're going to go to a smaller city. So in my head I'm thinking like Milwaukee. Right. You know what I mean?
Smaller city. You know, a couple hundred thousand people and we get to some city. Don't ask me this particular one because it was. The experience was replicated more than once. So we're driving. He's like, this is a smaller city and it's like a high rise is in like a metro. And I was like, oh, okay. He's like, but it's only got like 4 or 5 million people. And I was like, gotcha.
Were you before you got to the rural, rural area, were there more people than you thought? Because that, like, that's the thing about China. There are more. I understand there's more than a billion people. Like, I'm not ignorant. It's just that I didn't think I'd see so many people.
[00:12:04] Speaker B: Yeah, see, you were in a very. You were in a part I'd love to see. I'd love to go Shanghai into Beijing. Those are the two places I think just sound extraordinary. Kunming. I have no idea. You know, when you ask me numbers like that, I can't tell you, but it was a big city, it had high rises. It looked just like, you know, it didn't feel like. I've always heard, you know, Shanghai and Beijing being overpopulated and that you just can't. Right. Where you can walk. Yeah. Anywhere. Or, you know, the bicycle situation is. I never felt that way in any of the places I was in in China. In fact, most of the places, they were such tiny villages. I mean, one place that I went to, stone City, had 100 people in it.
[00:12:46] Speaker A: I know. So I find this fascinating because I think that. So we went to all these. I don't call them villages because they're not that small. Like, but we went to like all these other cities and towns to see things. Like, I, I wanted to see textiles. I wanted to go to the Foot Binding Museum. Like, I have my own weird quirks. So I wanted to see all these things and. But yet there were.
They were not empty and even when I took the. They had installed a high speed rail recently when I went, there were still. We went through rural areas on the high speed train, obviously very quickly, but they didn't seem as rural as I was looking for. So I think you had an experience that I was actually looking for it because any people who've been to Tibetan didn't even feel that that was that rural. But you had this experience of being in China and not being constantly surrounded by people.
[00:13:34] Speaker B: Oh, totally. And we were there in. I left. It was January. We started shooting, I think the first week of February and we shot through April so there was no tourism going on there.
What little bit of that that they had like in Shashi, which was known for its shoes and what little bit was there, no one came at that time of year. It was cold and gray and.
[00:14:02] Speaker A: Yeah, I just did you. So how can I, how can I ask this?
Would you call it now in retrospect, like a more adventurous travel experience?
[00:14:16] Speaker B: Oh my God. I knew. You know, it's funny when, when you take a job in la, when you're freelance and you take a job, typically most movies are not, you know, they're not going to go anywhere, most of them. And if they do go anywhere.
[00:14:33] Speaker A: Right.
[00:14:34] Speaker B: Let's face it, you know, it's like we work, it's a job. We're a factory town, right. So I took this job because I knew, you know, you take it because of the people or because of the experience.
Very seldom are you ever offered a job where you go, oh my God, this is the best project and it's going to win an Academy Award.
[00:14:54] Speaker A: Right?
[00:14:54] Speaker B: That just doesn't like. Well, it didn't happen to me at all. So when I heard this, I was like, this is an amazing experience. Like, I know whatever happens, like this is a once in a lifetime opportunity and how cool is it to be able to do this? I had no idea I was going to be writing about it. It just was not on the radar then. I did not take notes. I mean, Facebook had just started and that was my only communication then. So I got on Facebook to keep in touch with people and I just took photographs. I didn't write anything down.
So that was kind of my journal of reminding me what I had done. And so it's kind of fun because as the book comes out on the 14th of January, Chinese New Year starts and it'll also line up with about the time that I got To Yunnan. So I'll be able to be in the groove of. Oh, yeah, this is where I was doing, where I was. What we were doing. And it'll be a really fun.
[00:16:02] Speaker A: I wonder. I feel like when I was trying to. When I was okay, I knew. I know Google was banned. I wonder if Facebook was banned. I know Twitter was banned. So. Yeah, so at the time they. The access to social media, that wasn't. I can't remember the most social media popular thing in China at the time. Everything was banned. So I. And I don't know if I was on social media at that time, but I didn't share details because it was too much for the VPN and the uploading and all of that to do that. So it was sort of like I went away and came back and then told people how it was. Did you? Okay, so. So I have some questions. What was the idea of doing the Cinderella movie like? It's just. I know fairy tale retellings are popular, but doing it this way was interesting. Is there a reason why it was shot in Mandarin?
[00:16:54] Speaker B: Well, the director who. The director who I'd worked with actually had found some documents that dated back to 975, I believe, and he believed that this documents that he found were the original telling of the Cinderella story and that he felt that Cinderella was Chinese. And all this time we thought it was a European story, but it's actually Chinese. And so he had all these different actors that were speaking all different kind of dialects, and he was planning on dubbing it anyway because there were so many different actors that were in there that were speaking. He didn' what any. Because he didn't speak. He didn't speak. He didn't speak Mandarin at all.
[00:17:42] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:17:43] Speaker B: And then we saw all these. His assistant.
His assistant was, you know, like my assistant in that, you know, we were. We had, you know, people who were telling us what was going on. But. Yeah, and then there were dialects that I think nobody really even knew what they were saying.
[00:18:04] Speaker A: Wow. It's just. That's a unique storytelling. I'm trying to think was this at the time when movies about what I call historical Chinese movies were popular? Because there was a phase. I'm not really good with time since I moved to California because it's sunny and warm every day, and that gives me no perspective. But there was, like, this phase, I want to say, like in the early to mid 2000s where Chinese historical dramas were a thing.
Was that part of that time?
[00:18:34] Speaker B: I don't know. What I can tell you is Like I said, this director, he'd been working on this for a long time. He'd adopted two little Chinese girls. So really the story itself was very important for him to tell the story because he felt very connected with his adopting the two little girls. And so, you know, it was a very personal story for him.
Yeah, so it's been dubbed in different languages.
[00:18:58] Speaker A: It's been dubbed.
[00:19:01] Speaker B: Yeah. I don't know how you can find, you know, but I know it's out there.
[00:19:06] Speaker A: So how. Well, let me go back. So in the, in the beginning of the book you talk about editing commercials. How did you fall into that? Because I know people who do. Well, I know people who do movie editing. Actually I don't know anybody who's ever edited a commercial.
But how did you come to that?
Because let me say this, people don't like pop up one day and they go, I want to edit commercials. Most people I don't know, there's all, there's one of everything. What do I know?
[00:19:33] Speaker B: But it's very true. I worked my first jobs were working in broadcast television and I worked in movie promos. Basically. That's what. Yeah, I'd watch the movie and then cut a 30 second spot for you to, you know, watch the movie. And then when I moved out to la, I thought, oh, I'd like to work in trailers. Right. That was sort of the natural progression.
[00:19:56] Speaker A: Right.
[00:19:56] Speaker B: But I didn't, I didn't make that connection. I made a couple and then somebody I met somebody who knew somebody where they just bought their first Abbott. It was 1991 and they said, come over here. And it was for a TV show for tbs, it was for environmental show for Earth Day. And we just, there wasn't enough storage.
It really wasn't at that time set up to do anything longer than commercials. And so what happened was when I finished that gig, it was like I had a skill now that was just like. First of all, nobody was using Abbott other than commercial short form really was using it because it long. Like I said, we just. There was nothing bigger than a three gig storage at that time.
[00:20:48] Speaker A: I remember.
[00:20:50] Speaker B: So yeah, 1.5 and three gigs is what we had. Three gig was like really expensive and hard to come by. And so I wound up in commercials and I, I loved it because I didn't think I would. I just wound up because of the scale that I had and there was lots of money being made and I got to go to New York and San Francisco and it was just. Was great. I, I don't know I loved it because it was short. And if I didn't like the. The people, they were out of the room within like a, you know, a couple weeks, I didn't like the spot.
[00:21:24] Speaker A: That's true. It's not like a movie. You weren't committed for so long. That's funny. Yeah, totally, Because I had.
[00:21:31] Speaker B: It's funny. I was cutting something for, you know, I'm not going to name names, but she was an Academy Award winner and she came in, she had a cast on her leg and she said she wanted to know all about commercials. She didn't know anything about it. And, you know, she goes in to start telling me this story about how she got in a fight with the director and tripped over a garbage can and broke her leg as she was screaming at him. And then she had to turn around and go back into, you know, Monday morning with a cast on her. Go back to work. And so the short form sounded really attractive to her because movies can go on forever and ever and ever. And she was just really like, oh, this sounds really great. I said, yeah, it is. Because if, you know, if you don't like the footage or you don't, you know, like, sometimes I'd be cutting cars, sometimes I'd be cutting comedy, sometimes I'd be. And it was great because it was always something different.
[00:22:23] Speaker A: So wait, I was gonna ask you about broadcast, because I think so I.
I had an interest, I guess, in broadcast news. It's so long ago, but I did, like, internships in, like. Oh, my God, I'm gonna reveal my age. 89, 90. And, well, we had technology. It wasn't the 50s, but it wasn't. But it was.
There's something about the way you described it, because I feel like. And I don't know, because I haven't been in broadcast news in years. I have friends, but we don't talk about it. But it was very intense because we did live news, the 6 o'clock news at night. And it's like. It's a half an hour or 22, 23 minutes. And it feels so very intense and of the moment. And you can't make any mistakes or you have to fix your mistakes immediately. And you talked about how it had given you, like a headache or something. What did you think going in that you would like the immediacy of that?
[00:23:25] Speaker B: You know, that was just the first job I got going in. I had no. I had no interest in news, but it was the first job in a local TV station that I got put in. And I Wanted to throw up. Every day I went in because it was so intense that 22 minutes and 50 seconds. But then as soon as the 6 o'clock news was over, it was like, boom, we were onto the 11 o'clock news. And whatever happened, people had forgotten about because everybody was so busy gathering all. What have we got going on for the 11 o'clock news?
And that was the only good thing about it. But it was just.
There was no room for creativity.
[00:24:06] Speaker A: Okay, I'm going to think about it because I don't think. I don't even know if we thought like that. I will say this because I thought about you because. So my first. That first job was in Worcester, Mass.
[00:24:17] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:24:18] Speaker A: I can't remember the name of the station. It's defunct. And then they all moved to like Springfield or something. It was an NBC affiliate, I don't know, for 14 seconds. But so it was in Worcester, Mass. And you had two options. You could either do the news at 6 or whatever, which was a very short period of time before and after, or you could go out during the day and shoot the packages. So that's what I ended up doing because it was less intense. And so we drive around. Oh my God. Massachusetts, between Boston and Worcester, interviewing like, I remember interviewing John Kerry and he was very tall. But it was just because, like, I'm short and the camera angle was horrible and I didn't think ahead about that. But I.
It was, it was intense and it wasn't. For some reason, I thought it was going to be more fun. I don't know if that's the broadcast news or it seemed like it was going to be more fun than it was and it wasn't nearly as much fun. And there was no, there's. You're right. So as soon as it was done, they're onto the next thing. And it wasn't particularly retrospective.
It's like, news, let's go. Move on. Tomorrow. Tomorrow's the next thing. Tomorrow's the next thing. Tomorrow's the next thing. How long were you doing that? Because I was like, oh, this is not what I thought it was. And I was out.
[00:25:22] Speaker B: Yeah, me too. I think I did it maybe three months. And it was depressing. You know, it was always a fire, a robbery, a murder. And then, you know, it would cut to the weather and then the sports, which was always boring to me. And then at the end there'd be like some sort of happy go lucky story about a dog being found or something. Right. Then it was, we have to end.
[00:25:43] Speaker A: With an upbeat note. I was always told murder, mayhem, upbeat.
[00:25:49] Speaker B: So, yeah, I just. I'm not a news junkie, and I think you have to really be somebody like that who's really into. I gotta tell you what the latest stuff is, and I'm just not that kind of gal.
[00:26:02] Speaker A: Yeah, I didn't. It didn't stick either. I. In my head, going back, it could have. I don't know. I don't know. I had a friend who left and then did morning news or infotainment, whatever you want to call it now for, you know, like the. Like the Good Morning America, CBS News kind of thing, which was less intense. More. More. More dog stories.
So you. You talked about in the book editing, like, this movie called 20 Dates, which I don't know what. When was that? I don't watch movies that much, so I'm not. I'm the wrong person for feature film information.
[00:26:34] Speaker B: It's okay. That was. It came out in 90 or 99. I think it came out in 98. 99. But we won slam Dance Film Festival, the Audience Film Festival. And we edited the whole thing in the edit bay. So it was basically written, you know, all.
We wrote it. And then we would go and play this. You know, play the film for.
We would go to the Gerst agency and invite 20 people to come watch it. And we'd think we'd written this really great joke and it would fall flat and, you know, and it was crazy. We wound up, you know, basically, it was still wet out of the lab when we got on the plane to go to Park City. And we owed Miles, owed everybody money. And then before we even left, it was bought by Fox Searchlight. It was a real Cinderella story. It really was. And then I got to go work for Fox for six months on the lot, which was really fun.
And I met some really cool people there. And then I got to go on the Promenade back when they ran for six weeks at a time. And I would walk by every day. I'd walk by and see my name on the movie poster. And it was so cool because the movie ran for six weeks, which doesn't happen at all anymore.
[00:27:55] Speaker A: No, I was just talking to somebody. I'm like, it's in and it's out. You know, somebody's like, you're gonna see my movie. I'm like, I guess I gotta see it right now because next week may not be there.
Yeah. And the runs now. Somebody was. They were only. It was like. I don't call it a half a run, but it was they were like, they're running it during the week, but not during the weekend peak hours, which is the first time I've heard of that. Oh, I know. I. Yeah, I know. I didn't ask more questions about it, but I have. I have questions.
Did you. So after that experience, though, you did not, like, make a leap to features? Is that. Do you think, in retrospect, you would. I'm not. I'm not advocating for features. It's just that it feels like everybody I know who has edited, that's like, that was their. They were doing sports or a lot of people in ESPN or whatever, doing these random editing jobs, and they were like, but what I really want to do is features, because I want to tell a longer story.
[00:28:51] Speaker B: Here's my thing with features. I was a girl, first of all. I didn't get married till I was 49, so I needed to make a living, and I had to eat. And the truth of the matter is, to get a film off the ground in Hollywood, people just don't realize, like, it's like crazy, like, to get the financing, to get. Like. It's just. I would know people, but then, like, you know, actually making it happen. I mean, the Cinderella one, this took forever for him to get the financing. And it's just, I need to eat. I need a regular job. And with commercials, they had a $25 million air buy, so the spots had to be cut.
[00:29:33] Speaker A: They were going to get done. Yeah, right.
[00:29:35] Speaker B: It wasn't like. So that's what was so great about commercials. Plus, I just loved it. I had 30 seconds to get your attention. I had 30 seconds to, you know, tell a story. And that, to me, was very challenging. I loved it. It was fun. And I got to work with people and, you know, which a lot of times you're. As an editor, you can be alone in a dark room and not see anybody.
Right, Exactly. So that was. The creative part, was I would have a couple of days on my own with commercials, and then they would come in and tell me to add more product. And that's typically. Can you linger longer on the car? Can you linger? Right. That was typically what happened. But, yeah, I just. I love the fact that, you know, then people would come in and I'd have company, and then we'd all work together and finish it, and then it would go off and go to air.
[00:30:31] Speaker A: No, that's true. I always think about. I was talking to somebody about that, and I was like, if there's money, the thing will be done, right? Because nobody's leaving them when he's leaving money on there, there's time. There is time to fill and it will be filled.
[00:30:47] Speaker B: But it always. Like I had another friend who was a director and like I waited and waited and waited around for him to get his movie made. And then it wound up being like a $6 million movie, which back in the early 90s was nothing to laugh about. I mean, nothing sneezed. And he.
Sony, Sony Classics decided it was too arty to even put money to market it in, so they just shelved it. And so, you know, you can go through all of that to get the money to actually go out and make the movie and then the studio goes. It's too much for us to promote, so we're just not even going to. Not even going to get to show it.
[00:31:28] Speaker A: Yeah, no, there's a. There's a high heartbreak quotient in. In la. I'll just say that I think I feel like in my 20s, everything, I took everything personally. Now I'm like, whatever, next thing.
But I don't. You can't take it personally because to me there's no rhyme or reason to it. I know that I can figure at all. So I. I'm gonna. I'm sorry. So you moved around a lot as a child. What was your favorite place to live?
[00:32:01] Speaker B: Oh, I think LA is now okay. I've been here 30, 35 years almost, I think now. So I think I kind of like it here.
But as a kid, you know, I lived mostly in this. We moved around a lot. But my family, one portion of my family is from the south and the other part is from Europe, but, you know, so I still have my brother and sister, they still have a place in North Carolina. My sister has a place in England and my mom does.
But yeah, I mean, LA has become home to me. It really like, you know, I don't. I don't know. I love it here. What can I say? I think it's a pretty fabulous place to be. I've made some really great friends and can't beat the weather.
[00:32:55] Speaker A: It's actually really good. Today I went out for a walk and it was actually sunny. It has been sunny in a couple days and I was like, oh, the sun's back and there's freeze.
[00:33:03] Speaker B: It's really nice.
[00:33:04] Speaker A: Yeah, it's not bad today, I'll say that. It's not bad. It's not bad.
What did you.
Do you think your love of travel came from the fact that you moved around a lot and were okay with how can we say that there's a little bit of uncertainty in travel or adventure and travel, or is it something. Some other reason that you think that you were called to travel, called, enjoyed?
[00:33:34] Speaker B: No, I think my family definitely, you know, it's funny because, you know, I see people who, you know, where I would live in these little towns, and nobody ever. They're still living there. You know, where my father was up until the day he died, My father, I don't know, I think there was six countries he hadn't been to otherwise. He'd been to every country in the world and many times over. And he loved that all he wanted to do was travel and read books.
[00:34:01] Speaker A: And I admire that.
Right.
[00:34:05] Speaker B: It's a pretty good way to spend your time. And he loved it. And I think I. You know, and movies. He was the one who gave me my love for. You know, he would take me to the drive in and, you know, I saw Mary Poppins three times in one week. I loved it so much. And between that and reading books, I think that's where I really learned to, you know. And television was also at that time when I was little. You know, it's kind of my babysitter. Saturday mornings, man, I got up and watched cartoons. And, you know, it was. It was a pretty happening thing.
[00:34:40] Speaker A: So what's your favorite place that you've been? What's your favorite country that you've been to?
[00:34:45] Speaker B: Oh, my God, Italy. I'd go to Italy.
I could live there. Chris and I keep talking and trying to figure out a way how we can actually make that happen. I'm worried that I'd weigh about 500 pounds, though, because, like, between the gelato and the pasta and the.
It's so good.
[00:35:03] Speaker A: What's your least favorite country?
[00:35:08] Speaker B: God, I don't know. I can't say that I have any of those. I was going to say, I also found Iceland really interesting. Have you been there?
[00:35:15] Speaker A: Yeah, I went two, three. Oh, my God.
I think either 2019 or 2021. I have to think about it. Not 2020.
[00:35:24] Speaker B: I know that I also went to Antarctica. My husband and I went to Antarctica, and that was an uber cool trip. That was really amazing to stand with the penguins. Actually, I like to dance with the penguins because, you know, that's what happened in Mary Pop.
Wait.
[00:35:42] Speaker A: What did you find interesting about Iceland? Because I had always wanted to go, but I. When people ask me why, I'm like, I don't really have a good answer. I just want to see it. Like, I want to see it.
[00:35:51] Speaker B: Yeah. That was kind of me, too. But I went to. I went in February. I went. Actually, I was there the week before we closed down for lockdown. It was there the week before and we kept hearing it. And I always wanted to go to the Blue Lagoon, which we went to at night, which I would highly recommend.
We couldn't get in during the day, and so we just took the nighttime reservation, not knowing anything. And to be in that. I don't even know if it's still open now because of the whole volcanoes and everything. But. But it was really cool at night. I'm not a night person, so it was an adventure.
[00:36:25] Speaker A: So I would ask you this because I found it. So I went in November.
How can I say this? It was. Well, no, I had a warm coat. It was not as cold as I thought it was going to be. I wanted to see glaciers. I think maybe that's one of the reasons I wanted to go see glaciers. And we did a glacier hike, which was super fun, but the whole. Did they. So did you get into the history of why there's no trees and all that? I thought it was literally fascinating.
[00:36:51] Speaker B: No, because I went to see the aurora borealis and I was there for 10 days and didn't see it.
[00:36:56] Speaker A: I did not see it either. That is the reason I remained. One of my greatest life disappointments. I cannot tell.
It was cloudy and overcast the entire time I was there. And I went in November, so it was dark, like, you know, 95% of the time and still nothing.
[00:37:15] Speaker B: And we were freezing.
[00:37:16] Speaker A: Freezing.
[00:37:17] Speaker B: We had a driver take us out in the middle of nowhere and it was so cold. And we'd get out of the car, like, going, where is it? Where is it? And we couldn't find it.
[00:37:25] Speaker A: So, yeah, yeah, that's on my list of things that I will. I'm thinking about if I go to Sweden at the right time of year, I'll get it. I have a plan. I have a plan. I have a plan, but not yet. So then I'm going to ask you this other thing because this made me laugh in the book that you talked about, like, because, you know, it's like lifetime, lifetime for women. But you're like, if lifetimes for women, why are women always being killed on the channel? Which is. I'm going to tell you. This is like a thought I have constantly, because every.
I'm like, this is a lot of women in jeopardy. Like, it's a lot of women in jeopardy. And I have a lot of questions as to whether or not that Sells. Although they were there before the true crime era, so I guess they were prescient in that way. Yeah.
[00:38:13] Speaker B: It's funny because it's very different from Hallmark. Right. Hallmark Song about the romance and lifetime seems to be. Their lifetimes are short on there.
He's always getting killed.
[00:38:25] Speaker A: Right?
[00:38:25] Speaker B: It's so weird. I don't. I don't know. I don't watch it. I can't watch it. There's. But, yeah. Anyway.
[00:38:31] Speaker A: No, no, I think about it all the time, but I don't watch it. But there's. But there. I have a friend who loves true crime, and she's like, did you see this one? The woman dated this guy and he. I'm like, don't tell me. Don't tell me, because I know it's not. The answer is not. It didn't go well.
There's no. There's no upside on that one. Okay, so let me go back. What made you want to write a memoir? Because they are. I don't say they're hard, but you have to choose a slice of life. Unless you're a president or something, in which case everybody. You can write three about your whole life, but you have to choose a slice of life and, you know, expound on it. What made you want to do that?
[00:39:13] Speaker B: Well, to be honest with you, I. You know, I was taking some writing classes, and my teachers were both like, you don't want to write a memoir. Memoir is dead. Nobody talks. No one. You know, write. Make it a novel. Turn it into a novel.
So I did. I wrote it. You know, the first pass was totally in novel form.
I just kept thinking it was such a magical time that to not own it, not share that with others, that it was. I don't. It just felt like I don't know anybody. I don't.
[00:39:56] Speaker A: It just.
[00:39:57] Speaker B: I just felt like anybody can. And that's not true, because that's. I can't write a novel. But anybody. It just felt like it needed to be told and I needed to own that story. I needed to say, this is what happened to me. And it was so magical. If you just allow life to be and allow yourself to experience the uncomfortableness, maybe, of being in a foreign place and of not being able to speak the language, but knowing that just by being kind, that kindness is a universal language. It really is. You know, by smiling and helping people or doing what, you know, we can communicate without actually speaking a word. And I think that's why I love my dog so much, is because they've taught me that, you know.
[00:40:49] Speaker A: No, I think that's true. I think that's the thing that I've learned most in travel. Well, a. That people are all the same, which is. It's good or bad, depending on how you feel about that. But I do find that communication is.
It's always there, even when there's a language barrier there, because you can. Especially when you're with people as opposed to like on the phone or something. It's the tone and everything around, except for the words, communicates so much.
And that's something. Yeah.
What.
This is the weirdest. What attracted you? So in the book, you adopt the Cinderella. Cinderella's the dog and. Which is on the COVID So it's not unclear. I just want to describe it for listeners. What made you adopt a dog? Like, I've seen so many dogs, especially there's so many countries with a lot of. I don't know if you've ever been to Greece, which has, like the, you know.
[00:41:45] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:41:46] Speaker A: The most strays, but they have laws around that, which I have a lot of questions about. But what made you decide to adopt a dog?
[00:41:55] Speaker B: Well, you know, I was so lonely, you know, there to begin with. And like I said, originally my assistant was supposed to be with me. And then he wound up needing to be on the set. And I found myself, you know, by myself. And I would take a walk and there was this little dog that was tied to this fence and I would go and spend time with it and.
And I just, you know, to see a little dog tied to a fence really broke my heart.
And it really. I honestly, you know, and I know animals are different in different countries. And I've been there. I, you know, I've been experienced in that. I lived in Africa. I lived in all kinds of places where people are just, you know, we're all different in how we see things. And even though we are the same.
[00:42:47] Speaker A: Right, right.
[00:42:49] Speaker B: And I, and, you know, I believe in respecting that, but it still breaks my heart to see a little, you know, I just, what can I say? I'm a dog girl. And I, you know, luckily the director looked at me and said, we'll find her a home.
[00:43:09] Speaker A: I know. It's just so.
I didn't think, like, I. I've been to lots of places and I've seen lots of animals. And I think to myself, this is not my culture. And I. This is, you know, you do you. And I have to walk away.
But I don't know if I would ever think, well, let me. Let me scoop this one. Up. Like, I just. I think I would never think it was possible, but I thought. You thought it was possible or it became possible?
[00:43:35] Speaker B: Well, the director looked at me, and I think he just felt sorry for me because I was standing there crying and, we'll find her a home. And I was like, of course we will. So, you know.
[00:43:46] Speaker A: Oh, yeah.
[00:43:47] Speaker B: Somebody just thought something differently. Like, we don't have to sit here and cry about it. We could do something about it. And so with that, you know, we went and got that one. And then the second one. Of course, then I was known as, you know, this little blonde lady who didn't speak a word of Mandarin, who walked around with his dog.
But then when we went to the next village, that's who I became was this, you know, foreigner who had this dog that that's all she spent with. And then, you know, I don't want to give away too much of the book, but, you know, the other one was. I was given. I didn't take that one.
[00:44:21] Speaker A: No, I was actually. I was having coffee with a friend the other day, but it was in the neighborhood where the first house we bought when I moved here was. And I was talking about how, like, when my neighbors met me, they called me the Dog Walker. And I was like, why? And they're like, you're out every day with the dog. And I thought, okay. Like, I didn't think of that as my personality, but apparently I was out all the time with my dog.
So I can see. I see. I've seen that happen. You know, you're like, oh, you're the dog person. You're like, I guess, you know.
Although I don't see myself particularly as a dog person because I grew up with. We always had pets. So I don't have, like, a separate identity from always having pets in your house.
But. So can I ask you, how did you come to your pet naming conventions? That's what I'm going to call it. Because the dog that you had in the book, the LA dog, was Ron Howard.
And then you had other names that are. Okay. My dogs have always names, like, you know, Muffin or something. So, you know, my first dog, I remember my mother's like, you can name the dog. I'm like, that dog's gonna be called Muffin, which was cute when I was a. As I got older, you're like, I could have thought that through.
So, you know. Yeah, so that. So I. I have more infantilized dog names, but you have more adult names. But how did you come to your Naming convention.
[00:45:50] Speaker B: This one right here in my lap right now is Elvis. Bruce Wayne. He does look like Batman, doesn't he? Yes, Bruce Wayne. And I just. Honestly, I like saying Elvis. I realized that, you know, I'm sorry.
[00:46:02] Speaker A: As you say, your dog's ears are Perkins.
Your dog's like, what? What? What's going on? Walk through the streets.
[00:46:10] Speaker B: I think it's important to call your dog a name that you want to. That you're not embarrassed to say, that you want to say a lot because you're going to do that over many, many years. Do you want to say Elvis? It's a fun name to say, right versus bot. Who wants to say Spot that to me or Lucky Just did not sound like a fun name to me. Elvis sounds fun. Ron Howard sounds fun. Josie. Alvin. I had Alvin before I had Elvis.
You know, they're fun names for me.
[00:46:40] Speaker A: So I'm laughing because my grandmother, when I was my father's mother's dog, she had a German shepherd was named Beauty, and she thought the dog was beautiful. Big German Shepherd, I don't know. But we said Beauty a lot.
These were not. You think more about it than anybody ever thought about my grandmother's dogs. My other grandmother decided to name them Winifred and Tenifred. She had two terriers, a large one and small one. But then we walked around saying Winnie and Tinny all the time. And, like, we had a dog named, though.
[00:47:10] Speaker B: Those are great names.
[00:47:12] Speaker A: So they were always very, like, diminutive names where you're outside and you're like, clearly she's talking about a dog. Like, she's not talking about, you know, Alvin. It sounds like you may be calling a friend who's coming over.
[00:47:26] Speaker B: Well, also, you know, I will tell you, I really never liked my name, my first name. I just really felt like, you know, because I was born in an era where there was thousands upon thousands of Lisas. And so I always had to feel. I always went through life with my name was two names. Lisa Cheek. It was never. I never introduced myself as Lisa. It was always Lisa Cheek. Because I figured you knew 50 of them. And, you know, this is who I was, was Lisa Cheek. So I'd much rather have a more interesting first name, like Madonna.
[00:47:58] Speaker A: Hello.
[00:47:59] Speaker B: She never needed a second name. Jlo.
[00:48:02] Speaker A: Right.
[00:48:02] Speaker B: Like, you know, that would be great.
But no, I got Lisa. Lisa Cheek. So there you go.
[00:48:09] Speaker A: Did you grow up with dogs? Because that's something in the book that you don't touch on.
[00:48:14] Speaker B: Yeah, I. In there, I briefly say that I couldn't have a dog until my mom left. And then my dad gives me a dog. And that's the first dog I get. Is my mother's allergic to dogs. I had very unusual pets. I had a. I had a.
I had a parakeet named Leonard Warm feet.
Then I had a guinea pig named Harold Browder.
Yes. He's like my dad's friend.
[00:48:41] Speaker A: It's a thing.
[00:48:44] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:48:46] Speaker A: Like his name Mitzi. Like, it wasn't this deep at all.
[00:48:51] Speaker B: Yeah. You know, characters. I love characters and names that. To me, I love names. I just do. Because, like I said, I've really never liked mine. And I think names are magical. They just are. They say so much about a person, you know?
[00:49:09] Speaker A: So wait, so you were ahead of the trend because. So there's a woman I know who. She had a dog, and her dog was named Fred. And then her daughter's dog was named, like, George or something like that. And she was like, I like adult male names for a dog. And I think that for some reason, I think it's adorable because whenever she's like, fred's coming. You know what I mean? I was like, it tickles me.
So I guess you're tickled more by names. I don't think. I do think, like, my son and I talk about this. He was like, your next dog. I was like, I'm already got a list of names. Like a thing.
A list of names. But you do think about it more. So you were saying you would come up with the name Ron Howard. Is it because you watched. Oh, my God. I can't think of the name of the show. I can see it in my head. Thank you, Sarah. Yes, exactly.
Wait, have you met Ron Howard?
[00:50:00] Speaker B: No. I would love to one day, though. Maybe one day I will.
[00:50:05] Speaker A: I don't think he gets out as much as he used to. Everybody's older now. It's just. It's a thing. So how do you feel?
How do you feel now being an author and going about, like, doing the promotion for this book? How has that been?
[00:50:23] Speaker B: You know, it's a bit overwhelming because I'm working on a second and third memoir right now, and there's just no, like, time to do anything.
It's just like, really, I mean, like, I really want to spend time and I'm realizing now, and I'm also, you know, going to a lot of conferences and festivals and things. I'm super excited. I'm going to. Have you been to the San Miguel Writers Festival in Mexico? I've never been, and so I'm going this year, but I'm also going to Kauai. And so, you know, I feel incredibly busy and incredibly lucky to be able to go to all these things because I'm so late to this game. You know, I really, you know, this is my first book at 62. So.
[00:51:09] Speaker A: But wait, what makes you feel late to the game? Like, I mean, okay, there's the three wunderkinds, and I've met all of them who, you know, wrote their first book at 25 and, you know, sold a billion. But that's not most people.
I mean, most people need more life experience in order to shape a story. I'll say it that way.
[00:51:28] Speaker B: I think that's true. But I also, honestly, I mean, I did love writing and going to writing classes, but I never.
I don't know.
This is crazy dream that, you know, it got picked up. First person I showed it to and wanted to publish it. And, you know, it's. It's been really quick, even though it's been 20 years in the making. It was like, you know, the first person I showed, it was like, oh, yeah, I want to do this. And I was like, okay.
[00:51:56] Speaker A: It's like the LA overnight sensation, right?
[00:51:59] Speaker B: Exactly, exactly. That's what. That's what they say. So.
And so it's. So I've been on a learning curve that's like, whoa. Because I didn't know anything about anything literary other than, you know, a book I would read. And that's all I knew. You know, I didn't even know who was in the business. Right. I just didn't. So I'm learning. I'm having to learn that.
[00:52:23] Speaker A: Yeah. So it's.
Yes.
[00:52:27] Speaker B: Other world.
[00:52:28] Speaker A: Yes. So. But I. When I. But I did meet you at the Happy Women, one of the. One or two of the Happy Women dinners book event. So you are aware to some degree of, like the gathering spaces for book talks, which in la, are not as plentiful as they are on the East Coast. Them from New York. So. Yeah.
[00:52:48] Speaker B: Yeah. I gotta tell you, though, I. There's nothing more I'd rather do. I love. I mean. I mean, I met you, I met the coolest women. When I go to these things, I just do.
I don't know. I feel so lucky whenever I get to go to a book event. I just. I got to go to the Reese Witherspoon thing recently. I met the coolest women there.
[00:53:14] Speaker A: So what.
So what do you have planned for January then? Because it's not cold here, so. That's the beauty of it.
So People will come out. It's not like, oh, it's going to be a blizzard. That's unfortunate.
[00:53:28] Speaker B: Crazy good. I've booked all kinds of events. I'm going to be at book soup on the 15th of January in Hollywood or on Sunset Boulevard, and then I've got a couple of happy women's. I'm going to be at Zibby's Bookshop on the 29th of January in Santa Monica.
And I'm going to. I just booked book passages in. What's it called? Quarter Mesa up in San Francisco.
I booked that for like. God, I can't even remember. Oh, I think it's the 23rd at 11am I've got a busy little schedule happening.
[00:54:09] Speaker A: That's so. It's. It's so interesting. How so? What is it like? Because being in the writing world, like doing writing classes, which I've done a lot in la, as opposed to the book world, what do you find different between the two?
[00:54:28] Speaker B: What do you mean?
[00:54:29] Speaker A: So I. Well, when. When I was doing writing classes, there were a lot of. Okay, there's a lot of writers. And I don't mean screenwriting and all that. I don't really. I know screenwriters, but I don't spend time with them in that sort of world.
But when I was going to writing classes, it was a very diverse, in terms of reading and writing, group of people. And I feel like the book world's a little more consolidated. People are into their genre or the kind of book they read. Or I read books by women or I read books by. About. Whether it's romance or whatever it is, or even like a lot of nonfiction topics, it's a little bit more focused. Where I found writing to be sort of diffuse with no particular. Not end or goal. The goals were all different. I think the goals were very different. And publishing. The goals are very specific. I want to publish this book and I want to sell to this group of people. Whereas writing was more expressive, but people had publishing goals. But they were really a little bit more amorphous for me.
[00:55:30] Speaker B: Yeah, I think you're very accurate on that, that's for sure.
Yeah.
It's funny because I do take a lot of classes online now, which is fabulous. Like, I can, you know, take a New York class or. And most of the classes I'm in usually have something to do with memoir. I've been taking this really great class where I just saw Melissa Fibo's last week talk, and she's amazing.
Just learning on what to put on. What can you Put in a memoir and what you should, you know, and to really be very clear that what you're putting in is not going to hurt somebody. And I think that's really important, and that you've healed. That's the big thing about writing memoir, too, is have you healed before you write it? Because otherwise it's just anger.
[00:56:20] Speaker A: That's so interesting, because this is so interesting, because somebody said to me, we're talking about somebody doing something last week, and my friend looked at me. She's like, what? But I don't think she's healed. And I'd never thought of it that way. And I was like, oh, you're right. I said, there's some people who are on this side and some people who are on that side. And it was. There was a lot of anger and craziness spewing out, and we were just like, that is. I never thought of it that way. But you're probably right for memoirs, because people will have to have reconciled those kinds of things. I don't know if you've read, like, I read this somewhere, like, My Body by Emily. I'm not gonna pronounce her name. Murtowski.
And it was super interesting because she had to. She was a model, which is. You know, it's. That is a world. I'll say that. Even more than acting. That is a world. And she really had to reconcile with the treatment of women in modeling before she wrote the book. But it was very interesting because it was. She had healed, I think, like, let's just say 80%. I think she would agree with this. And then she was saying that people had talked to her about the book, and she realized that she could have. It could have come later, but you can't know that at the time you're doing it.
And that's the. Yeah, yeah. You can't have the perspective.
[00:57:33] Speaker B: Yeah, yeah. That's why it's so important. I think when you are writing that you have to have a certain amount of distance to write it. I mean, that's why I'm frustrated that it's like, oh, I'm so old now. But it's like I had to. I had to work through it and see things in a different light in order to write it so that I could show you what I learned.
[00:57:53] Speaker A: Right, Right. Yeah.
[00:57:55] Speaker B: Nobody wants to read something where somebody's angry.
[00:58:00] Speaker A: I don't know. There may be a whole genre for that which would. So. So one of the things I do like to talk about is, like, what is the story? You're Trying to tell. But since you're saying that you are in the midst of continuing to write, like, story, personal stories, then what is the overall story that you're trying to tell versus the one that you were trying to tell in this book?
[00:58:21] Speaker B: Well, you know, it's funny because they say writers write the same thing over and over again, no matter how many books they write.
[00:58:27] Speaker A: My therapist would agree.
[00:58:30] Speaker B: You know, I don't know because I've only written one book so far. But I can tell you that a big theme of mine is that life is an adventure, you know, and it really.
It's all perspective, you know, and you can either see yourself a victim or you can see yourself as you're here to learn something and to share it with others and to be there for others and to.
Yeah. Share your experience.
And I'd like to think that, you know, and that I'm also. The other thing is, you know, just because somebody tells me I'm old doesn't. It's none of my business what they think. And also, you know, I get to be who I want to be. That's, you know, that's the other thing is, you know, I get to be, you know, be me because everyone else is taken.
[00:59:17] Speaker A: Right.
[00:59:18] Speaker B: Right.
[00:59:19] Speaker A: So can I ask you what. Because I'm looking. So for the listeners, I'm looking at the shelf behind you, and one of my. One of the memoirs I've enjoyed over the last 10 years is behind you. But what are some of your favorite memoirs?
[00:59:31] Speaker B: Which one is that? I want to know.
[00:59:33] Speaker A: It's the. Well, she's written more than one, because I have both two or three on my shelf. But Laurie Gottlieb, maybe you should talk to someone.
[00:59:39] Speaker B: It's lovely, isn't it? So good. So good. I have so many of. My favorite. My. Of course, my. One of my favorites is the Liars Club. I love the Liars Club. I love Abigail Thomas, what comes next and how to like it. Oh, fabulous book.
You know. You know, I love this question because I always ask writers this question.
You know, I love anything Dave Sedaris.
To me, he's like, I've always been a huge fan of his.
You know, I tend to like somebody who's going to make me giggle. You know, I have liked a couple of Jenny Larson.
Who else have I been reading lately? Well, Melissa Phoebos, like I said, she's extraordinary. And I'm reading a Chung book, Nicole Chung. She's fabulous. The book I'm reading now, it's so beautiful.
It's so Beautiful. I wish I could remember. Oh, the remedy, the life's Remedy, the rem. It's so good. I highly recommend that.
[01:00:48] Speaker A: What are you looking for in a memoir? Because I don't. Okay. So the Lord Gottlieb book, I read because a friend read it. So any. I have a couple of friends who, if they text me and they say, read this book, then I'll read the book and I don't ask any questions. So that's how I came to that book. So I. I didn't find it, although I did read it. I. When I went back on my shelf, it's still there. I read one of her previous books. What is it that you're looking for in a memoir? Because I'm. Well, I know what I'm looking for. What are you looking for?
[01:01:15] Speaker B: Well, I would say to you, you know, for me, I want to feel good. I like to. I've always felt that way about anything that I worked on is. I want to. I want you to leave feeling better than you did when you came to my work. It's just what I do. I don't feel like I need to educate you on anything because I am not an educated person. I'm not here to teach you anything other than to remind you that, you know, life is an adventure and that hopefully, you know, you know, just remember the good parts and remember, you know, that we're here to help each other. And that's, you know, and there's always a perspective. Choose the one that works best for you. Choose the one that's going to make you happy. Right. I think that's what I can offer. I can't educate you. I'm just not that smart. I don't have that much information to give you. But I can tell you that what I. What I appreciate about my life, and I can share with you what I. The joy I have.
[01:02:17] Speaker A: So then, for the. For the. Sit, Cinderella, sit. What do you. What is the theme of that? Or what is it that you're trying to get across? Because. Well, for me. Well, how can I say this? I don't write about traveling, so that's one of those things that I find fascinating. I'm always interested in people's experience of travel, but it's not something I personally write about ever. People always ask me that. I never write about it. So what is the. That you're trying to. Would you write about travel again? Let's start there.
[01:02:49] Speaker B: My next two books are not about travel at all. No.
[01:02:52] Speaker A: Okay.
Did you.
[01:02:55] Speaker B: But I will. I will I shouldn't say that. There is another book that I have sort of been mapping out that is about travel. So yes, travel is. Yeah, I definitely have a lot of adventures to tell you about. I do.
[01:03:12] Speaker A: Maybe my traveling is less adventurous. Actually. Nothing, I don't think any. Well, I'm going to say this, and I mean this, like, knock on wood, nothing ever happens. So I mean, you know what I mean, like, other than the experience itself, I don't, I'm not. But I'm not an adventure traveler. I have that friend and you know, he's like, I'm gonna go bungee jump and he's in like Bhutan. And I was like, okay, that's not something I think I would do. But go you.
[01:03:37] Speaker B: I took a 31 day cruise with my father up the coast of Africa from Cape Town to up to Dover. And I gotta tell you, that was truly another magical experience.
And it was, you know, I was in my. It was right when I came back from China. So, you know, he was in his 70s and I was in my late 40s and it was something else. Let me just say it was the first time I ever did a cruise. And yes, it's. I got some funny things to tell you about that.
[01:04:11] Speaker A: What made you decide to do that? Because I'm gonna. So as a child, obviously you travel with your parents because they're the ones, they're fun in the trip and they're taking you along. You know what I mean? So those, let me say the trips I went on in childhood were not ones I would choose in adulthood. Although, you know, I was thinking about this. So my parents like to go to the Caribbean. Oh my God. Where it's conceived. So that if the story, that's the story they tell. So. But I, and people are always like, oh, you don't ever go to beach vacations. And I thought to myself, I think I've been burned on beach vacations. Like, that's all we did. So I could never do it again. And it would be perfectly fine. But as an adult, what made you travel? Because I have one other friend who took a cruise with her mother. They did one of those around the world cruises and she could take someone and she took her mother. And I was like, how was that?
And it was.
Well, she knows her mother much better than she did. As you know, as an adult. That's, that's the most time they spent together as an adult.
[01:05:11] Speaker B: Yes, you definitely get to know them better. And that's how I did. I took a lot of Ashley that was how I found it. The best way to be with my father was because we would go on all these amazing cruises and things together because he loved to cruise. And you know, when I would go to his house, you know, it just got difficult. He was very. He was like an old lady in his house. And I was uncomfortable and you know, he wouldn't come to stay with me for. So it was just an even ground for us to visit, you know, when we went. And you know, he could go out, you know, he could go on the, on the adventure that day or not.
[01:05:48] Speaker A: Right.
[01:05:48] Speaker B: You know, I could go or not. Like, it was a. It was a good way for us to be together because we were on neutral territory.
[01:05:54] Speaker A: Right. No, that's, that's, that's actually, that's fair. Like, that's fair.
I, I'm too old to do that now, but I mostly travel with my son, so. And that's. He finally grew up. Like, Traveling with a 3 year old wasn't great, but traveling with a 14 year old is fine. Is mighty fine.
[01:06:12] Speaker B: Yeah.
[01:06:12] Speaker A: 3 year old.
I wouldn't do it. I don't know what I was thinking because I didn't want.
[01:06:17] Speaker B: Where are you gonna go with them? Where's your next vacation with them?
[01:06:21] Speaker A: Well, we're gonna. So I spend part of the time in Hungary. So we'll be there for Christmas because I'm usually there for Christmas and in the spring and in the summer.
But we went to Machu Picchu. This was, this was his idea. Let me say this. We were sitting around during the pandemic and, you know, looking at each other, not happily. And I was like, like, where would you want to go when this is over? And he's like, I just wanted to go to Machu Picchu. And honestly, like, this is not on my bucket list at all. So finally, Peru had a very, very bad Covid thing. So you couldn't travel for longer than other countries. Like two years they were closed, especially Machu Picchu. So he. So this spring, I was like, now's the time because for spring break, for school. And we went. And when we were on the trip, we encountered this, this Canadian Pakistani woman who Machu Picchu was her last world wonder. And he was like, that sounds like a great thing. I want to see the world wonder. So we've been to the Great Wall of China, when we were in China, and he was like, in. I guess Machu Picchu's on the list, which was interesting, but still not my top travel location. It was super interesting. It was just super interesting, but I would never think about it before. And so then he was like, like, can we go to the. Can we go to the Coliseum? And I said, I don't do Italy in the summer because we were there in Europe for the summer, for many weeks. And I was like, italy's too hot in the summer. I don't. No, no. So in the spring, I found it delightful and everybody says it's great in the winter, and I just haven't been. So we're going to see the Coliseum in December, and that's the next one after that. I don't know. We've been really talking about it because. Because I have traveled to most of the places I've want to travel, so I now it's just kind of open season.
[01:08:06] Speaker B: I love it. That's great. That's kind of how it was when my was. You know, and that's what's so great. If your son sounds like he's a good travel buddy for you and that you can take him and show him all kinds of places that you've been. And that's super sweet. I got to do that with my dad. He would. He was on a second and third time going places, and it was wonderful. I just, you know, we had a great time. Enjoy it. It is the best. Because, you know, the only thing constant is change, as they say.
[01:08:31] Speaker A: I know. And I feel like, you know, I mean, I don't want to say it's like four years left, but then he's going to go out college and do other things that don't involve hanging out with his mom.
So. I'll ask you this because somebody asked me this recently. Is there any place that you want to travel, like that ultimate travel bucket list thing that you haven't done?
[01:08:54] Speaker B: Yeah, I haven't been to Japan.
I really would like to see Japan and I really. There's more places in Italy I'd like to see, but, you know, other than that. You know, it's funny, I was thinking, you know, I'd love to see more of China. I just don't know whether I'll be able to do that or not.
I don't know. I just.
I'm just so grateful for all the experiences I've had. I am one lucky gal. You know, I've gotten to see a lot of the world and yeah, I'm super. I'm super excited that.
It's funny because Chris and I, we've kind of slowed down a bit as we're getting older now we're Starting to go. I don't know that I can do what we used to do.
And, yeah, we need a little more cushion to do some of these adventures.
[01:09:50] Speaker A: You're speaking to the choir. So I was like, let me hike the glaciers at, like, 50. And it was fine. But it wasn't as easy as it would have been at 30. Like, in 35. Like, I think I was in my 30s. I went to, like, Portugal. I don't know if you've been. And they have all these streets with all these little stairs, and I could run up and down all the stairs with those streets, and that was fine. It wasn't the same at 50. Like, this is a lot. And then even at Machu Picchu, they're like, you should drive these 400 stairs so you can see this thing. And I was like, should I? And I did. But there are people in the group who are my age and a little bit older who are like, maybe not. And I thought, oh, well, I guess then those kind of places need to come first, because I don't know if I'm going to want to hike 400 steps or there's so many steps, or, you know, all of that again.
[01:10:35] Speaker B: Yeah, no, I get it. And I don't. I mean, San Francisco is challenging enough for me to. Just crawling up the. Yeah. Hills of those hills.
[01:10:46] Speaker A: It's. Yeah. I was thinking about that because I used to go to San Francisco every year up until Covid, and I just really haven't resumed that, like, weekly trip a week. We would do a week up there, a weekend, long weekend. But yeah.
So what are you most looking forward to with the book stuff? I'll ask you that. That'll be my last question. Like, what is the thing that you're most looking forward to?
[01:11:09] Speaker B: Just connecting with people. I love hearing, you know, meeting people. Meeting whoever my readers are, finding out who they are.
[01:11:16] Speaker A: Who.
[01:11:17] Speaker B: Who will read my book? God, that'll be fascinating to find out who wants to read my book. I think that'll be interesting. And I'd love to hear what people get out of my book. You know, that to me, those are the two things I look forward to meeting. Meeting the people and look forward to seeing what they have to say about us.
[01:11:34] Speaker A: So I will say this. My experience and I write fiction, is that shockingly or not shockingly? Maybe I shouldn't be surprised. My readers are more similar to me than I would have thought. Like, you meet them in. Ostensibly, their experience is different. They're like, I live in Florida, I live in Wales. And you're like, okay, that's where we're on our different path. And then they'll start telling you some story, and you go, oh, that's really similar to me. I get why you get it. You know, I get why you get it. Because you had a similar upbringing or some. Some part. Some significant experience in their life will have been similar, even though that experience will not have been in the book.
[01:12:12] Speaker B: Right. We're more alike than we are different.
[01:12:14] Speaker A: Yeah. And in some ways, it. It'll speak to them, and then you'll do something. It's like in your book, you mentioned fago pop, which I've only heard of in Cleveland. I lived in Ohio briefly, and I was like, oh, my God, I haven't heard of that in years. But here we go. Like, it's just things like that. It'll. That will connect you in ways that I think I found surprising. You may not find surprising, but I.
[01:12:36] Speaker B: Found surprising Fago red pop. My dad used to drink Faygo red pop all the time when I was.
[01:12:43] Speaker A: I thought about it, because people didn't Ohio. And I was writing a book, and this woman, she was asking what to drink, and she opened it, and he was like, oh, my God. It was like, I remember that. Pour me that.
[01:12:54] Speaker B: Yeah, that's great.
[01:12:56] Speaker A: Yeah.
[01:12:56] Speaker B: Nice.
[01:12:58] Speaker A: It is.
So, Lisa, I want to say thank you so much for speaking with me.
[01:13:04] Speaker B: How fun is this?
[01:13:06] Speaker A: I know. And I really wish you. I don't say luck. I wish you an enjoyable experience on this journey because it's just. Book people are fun.
They are.
[01:13:17] Speaker B: I love it.
[01:13:18] Speaker A: And you're gonna get. You'll have an opportunity to meet so many of them going forward. Actually, most, I think, at the end of the day, book people, the people.
[01:13:27] Speaker B: I spend the most time with, I definitely. They're the only people I want to spend time with, but I would like it.
[01:13:34] Speaker A: It's the best. It's the best. I can't say any more about it. It's the best.
[01:13:39] Speaker B: Thank you.
[01:13:40] Speaker A: So, Lisa, thank you so much for doing this.
I only wish you the best for your book. Have fun on all the events and good luck on the next one. Because it's always the thing. Then you're like. But then. Then, then the next.
[01:13:57] Speaker B: Yep, that's how it is. It's always about the next one.
[01:14:01] Speaker A: Well, that book, the book world and entertainment have that in common. It's like what you do now and what are you. What are you doing next?
[01:14:09] Speaker B: That's right.
[01:14:10] Speaker A: I know other people with the movie premieres and then people like, what are you doing next? I'm like, oh my God, give it a second. Can we just.
[01:14:15] Speaker B: I know, right?
[01:14:16] Speaker A: Come out, give it a moment.
[01:14:17] Speaker B: Not allowed to breathe?
[01:14:19] Speaker A: No, not at all. But do breathe and take a moment. That's. That, that, that, that would be a true LA moment. Do take a moment to take it in and have, have as much fun as you can.
[01:14:29] Speaker B: Thank you.
[01:14:30] Speaker A: Thank you so much for doing this.
This has been a time to thrill with me, your host author Amy Austin. If you enjoyed today's episode, I hope your share rate and leave a five star review on Apple Podcasts, Spotify or wherever you listen. It will help others find and enjoy my conversations with brilliant women creators. Also, please hit the subscribe button on your podcast app. In addition to hosting this podcast, I'm the author of the Nicole Long Series of legal Thrillers. The first four books in the Nicole Long series are now live. You can download Outcry, Witness Major Crimes Without Consent and the Murders Began to e Reader right now. I'm also the author of the Casey Court series of legal thrillers. These titles are available wherever books are sold, your local library and also an audiobook.
My next book, His Last Mistress is available for pre order wherever you get your books. You can also follow me on Instagram and Facebook@legal thrillerauthor. You can find me on TikTok at Social Thriller Author. You can also find this podcast on Facebook at A Time to Thrill. Thanks for listening and I'll be back with you soon with more great conversations.
